A Knight in Dragonland

29 responses so far ↓

• 1    Marcy // Dec 29, 2006 at 12:36 am

  Dear Sir:
  I have followed for some weeks the back and forth on the school issue. while I am no expert, it seems most of the writers are down on Mr. Mangan because he has different ideas. Isn’t that what dialog is all about. Most seem to be focusing on him and not the logic and merit of the suggestions. The individual who maintaines this site seems well knowledged on the subject, otherwise he would have no room to critize the other party. So why don’t you ask the other side to debate you in public on the matter? Then the name calling could end and substance could start.
  Marcy

• 2    knightindragonland // Dec 29, 2006 at 3:32 am

  Well Marcy, I must say that you haven’t been following my posts very closely if you think that my primary opposition to Mr. Mangan is because he has “different ideas.” First and foremost, I am opposed to Mr. Mangan slandering anyone who has an opinion different from his own. It’s called argumentum ad hominem, and its a logically fallacious method of argument. He doesn’t attack the CONTENT of opposing viewpoints. He attacks the person. It’s divisive, and it shows that Mr. Mangan is incapable of defending his viewpoints with logic and reason.

  Am I opposed to consolidation? Yes … because I think it’s a distraction. Mangan goes on and on and on about the “low” test scores in District 108, but he fails to provide even one tiny SHRED of evidence that consolidation will do anything to change that. Consolidation does nothing to address the needs of Pekin students. So yes, I’m opposed to the “different idea,” and I’ve offered my reasons. Jim Mangan or anyone else is free to counter them.

  As far as debating in public … I’m assuming Mr. Mangan has a computer with internet access. My comments are open, so anyone can post here. Jim Mangan, Dean Bacon, Mike Noyes, Jiminy Cricket or anyone else is welcome to say their piece here whenever they would like.

• 3    Marcy // Dec 29, 2006 at 12:19 pm

  Sir:
  Oh come on, slander? I’ve read his letters and don’t recall anything but information from sources that are easy to check and refute if not true. No one has done that with evidence he was wrong. Just because you and other teachers don’t like the ideas, or the information doesn’t make them wrong. I imagine most crooks caught by the police don’t like policemen either. Is the police guilty of slander or the newspaper for printing the facts as they are? Calling a horse a horse is not slander if indeed it is a horse. And too, Mr. Mangan and others are not afraid or ashamed to put their beliefs above their names, do’ers not invisible talkers.
  Marcy

• 4    Matt // Dec 29, 2006 at 2:18 pm

  Well put Ms. Marcy. Some people can’t take the truth without blaming the messenger. The biblical story of Noah is a good example of this type of denial inside the Pekin school system.
  Matt

• 5    knightindragonland // Dec 29, 2006 at 5:21 pm

  Ohhh … so calling someone “weak-minded” or a “delusional drunk” isn’t slanderous?  You really consider that constructive criticism, Marcy?  I’ve heard nothing like that from any 108 board member, 303 board member or administrator from either district.  Jim Mangan is the only one not playing well with others.  He has the same tactics as a playground bully.

  Mr. Mangan’s “facts” are EASILY refuted, and I (and others) have done so on numerous occasions.

• 6    knightindragonland // Dec 29, 2006 at 5:34 pm

  The biblical story of Noah, Matt? Oh my … is every Mangan supporter a master of exaggeration like the man himself??? Next you’ll be saying that the Four Horseman will ride through Pekin if we don’t approve consolidation.

  As far as “blaming the messenger” … that’s EXACTLY what Jim Mangan does. Against anyone who has ideas different from his own, he attacks the MESSENGER, not the MESSAGE.

• 7    Marcy // Dec 29, 2006 at 8:04 pm

  Sir:
  Sorry, I have been reading both area papers, this and other sites, and have seen nothing from anyone that resembels evidence of refuting Mr. Mangan’s facts. His information has come from records that can be checked. Not one time have you or others produced PROOF to the contrary, or it would be printed in every newspaper this side of the Mississippi. What you have produced is just hot air.
  As far as the bully charge, I’m 50 years old and seen all sorts in my time and I think the problem with you and some others is, you can’t appreciate straight talk. You have been so use to political correctness you have become wimps. I think one writer described you has having no balls, same thing. In my neighbourhood when I was younger, they called your type pussies. Gave us girls a bad name.

• 8    knightindragonland // Dec 29, 2006 at 10:38 pm

  Can you two make an argument that doesn’t involve bodily secretions or genital references? Didn’t think so.

  I see what kind of supporters Jim Mangan attracts. Thanks you so much for making my case for me, Marcy and Matt. Please … keep talking!

• 9    knightindragonland // Dec 29, 2006 at 11:03 pm

  Anyone who wants to review the REAL facts regarding District 108 is welcome to do so at the Illinois Interactive Report Card. There you can see how district scores continue to improve and rank well against state averages despite the fact that a higher percentage of students are coming from impoverished backgrounds and a higher number of students have special education needs. There you can see that Dirksen and Willow Elementary are Illinois Spotlight Schools, Jefferson Elementary won an Academic Improvement Award and Sunset Elementary won an Academic Excellence Award.

  Chew on those facts and compare them to Jim Mangan’s rhetoric regarding District 108.  I’m really not sure what irrefutable facts of Jim Mangan’s that you’re talking about, Marcy.  Apparently you’re making them up!

  And then there’s this … Jim Mangan’s COMPLETE FAILURE to provide ANY evidence that consolidation will improve student academic performance. Care to take that one on? Please, Marcy and Matt … enlighten us. How is consolidation the salvation Mangan claims???

• 10    Paul // Dec 30, 2006 at 12:04 am

  Boy, if all 108 teachers are as onesided as you, nothing new and better will be learned by Pekin kids. My son is a teacher in Bloomington and he tells me this site is weighted towards showing only postitive information not the full picture.
  Even if consolidation did nothing as you think, the money saved would be reason enough to do it.
  Sounds to me like you have a personal interest, like much of your household income comes from 108, so you can’t be real open minded.
  Paul

• 11    knightindragonland // Dec 30, 2006 at 2:10 am

  I’m pointing out the inaccuracies in Jim Mangan’s arguments, so I must be in the pocket of District 108? (Slamming head against the wall). Does anyone out there have something CONSTRUCTIVE to say? Any ACTUAL ARGUMENTS??? Lord!

  I am not employed by District 108, and neither is anyone in my family. Three of my children are students in District 108 and my fourth will be eventually. I have a great interest in seeing the district succeed.

  Excuse me, but how is “here are the facts (the Illinois Interactive Report Card) … look at them yourself” one sided?

  I don’t think District 108 is perfect. Student-to-teacher ratios are too high. Compared to state and national averages, we spend relatively little per student. Some students are struggling. There is a high proportion of students on public aid and a high number of students with special education needs. The requirements of the No Child Left Behind Act get more stringent as the years go on … what does the district need to do to meet that ever-rising bar? How do we deal with these issues??? Consolidation addresses NONE of them. In fact, it DISTRACTS the school boards and the school administrators from addressing the real issues facing our students.

  As far as consolidation saving money … maybe it would, maybe it won’t. You can’t look at old data and make a prediction because a new tax rate would be determined by the binding referendum to establish a consolidated district. Administration costs to the district are less than 3% of the total budget, so axing a few administrators isn’t going to save us much money. Some people might actually see a tax INCREASE due to consolidation. We won’t know until a binding referendum is actually on the ballot and the voters can compare their current tax rate to the new one.

  The referendum won’t go on the ballot unless (Option #1) ALL feeder district school boards vote to put it there. That includes 98, 102, 137 and 606 … and NONE of those boards have shown the least bit of interest in this issue. (Option #2) is that the voters of ALL the feeder districts petition to have a binding referendum placed on the ballot. No one has stepped forward to start a petition drive to that end. Unless there is some other mechanism by which the two districts could consolidate, this whole issue is completely MOOT until one of those two things happens … so why are we wasting time on this issue at all???

• 12    Michelle // Dec 30, 2006 at 2:40 am

  Who will join me in putting a new referendum on the ballot that would require the teaching of logic?

  This exchange reminds me once again of how few people know how to think for themselves. In our system of democracy, it’s important that the citizens understand how to evaluate information and tell the difference between facts and opinions. Yet Mangan has supporters who, all evidence to the contrary, continue to say nobody has proved him wrong, continue to say people are just against Mangan rather than his arguments (when precicely the opposite is true — Mangan attacks those who disagree with him by calling them weak-minded, drunks, etc.) and who continue to ignore the fact that not one shred of evidence has ever shown that consolidation would improve education.

  I am teaching my two teens how to think for themselves. It’s a skill all too few people have. We are all individuals and it’s expected that we would have different OPINIONS, but we ought to all be able to agree on what is a FACT. That some people cannot even understand the difference is part of what is wrong with the world.

• 13    Paul // Dec 30, 2006 at 3:32 am

  It appears that several thousand individuals thought for themselves on the referendum. It appears many of those same individuals thought for themselves on the 108 tax increases. Also many of those voted for the new high school. So those individuals you try to indicate can’t think for themselves are smarter than you or the elite crowd give them credit for. When people are given complete information they know what is best for them. It appears you uppity folks just can’t live with the FACT that you can’t fool people like you use to. It appears from all writings why you can’t stand Mr. Mangan, he cuts through the crap and tells the truth. The real lesson that should be taught to kids is the majority rules, not just a select elite crowd.

• 14    knightindragonland // Dec 30, 2006 at 5:16 am

  Well Paul, I’ll give you credit that you make a valid point regarding the NON-BINDING referendum held in November. Then you go and ruin it by making YET ANOTHER ad hominem attack by calling me an elitist.

  Feh. With the crowd he attracts, Jim Mangan should be the boss of a street gang, not a school board member.

  I’m not trying to fool anyone, and Jim Mangan’s “facts” are about as reliable as quicksand. I’m actually crediting the Pekin public with more intelligence than you do, Paul. As I indicated with my capital letters above, it was a NON-BINDING referendum. I credit the people of Pekin for recognizing that fact. You don’t, apparently.

  I fault Mr. Mangan for (1) his inability to coordinate the proper placement of the NON-BINDING referendum, so that everyone in Tazewell County could vote on the darn thing, even though it had nothing to do with most of them; (2) his failure to properly research the requirements for consolidation under the Illinois statute before starting this whole mess. We apparently can’t do it at all without the approval of the other feeder districts (either by action of their school boards or petition of their citizens), which Mangan has thus far failed to obtain.

  Unless there’s another mechanism by which the two districts could merge without the approval of the other feeder districts, this WHOLE ARGUMENT IS POINTLESS. If such an alternative mechanism does exist, I would very much appreciate if someone “in the know” would tell us about it. If not … well, then Jim Mangan is just wasting everyone’s time. He better hop in his car and start trying to round up signatures in North Pekin, South Pekin, Marquette Heights and Spring Lake … or drive down to Springfield and try to get the law changed. Good luck with that!

  (SIGH)

  Thank you, Michelle. I’m glad you decided to join the “conversation.” Do you enjoy ramming your head against a brick wall on a Friday night?

• 15    jadedgirl // Dec 30, 2006 at 5:16 am

  Matt and Marcy-

  Oh my…
  Well…I noticed a comment saying that the consolidation would save the taxpayers money…LOL THAT is flippin hilarious considering that I lived in Pekin for 7 years and it seems to me that Pekin residents should be more concerned with the people they elect into office…like the men who steal money to gamble on OR how about taking away the parking bans on the streets of Pekin pilfering thousands of dollars of hard working peoples money by FORCING them to buy a parking light just to park on the street overnight if they do not have a driveway, and oh…need I comment on the ABJECT RACISM of Pekin? Here you all sit bitching and moaning about saving taxpayer money, when that IS ALL pekinnites seem to be concerned with MONEY. I would blame the politicians but I cannot considering that YOU the townfolk of Pekin are who voted them in.
  I worked in three of Pekins’ local resturants as a bartender/waitress. And I saw with my own eyes the pretentiousness of the people of Pekin, and the flat out cheapness of the wealthier of them. I worked in a resturant that had a 1.99 breakfast special that included 2 eggs, 2 bacon strips, 2 sausage links, and toast. Can’t beat THAT with a stick, I say…BUT NOOOOOO…we would get the lunching “ladies” who would come in before their leisurely day of golf and complain that coffee wasn’t included in the price! ONE FREAKIN NINETY NINE!!!! OH and the man and women who would come in for lunch and refuse a drink, but ask for water with extra lemon and proceed to squeeze six lemon slices into their glass and dump 10 packets of sugar into the glass and make “homemade lemonade” THIS WAS AN EVERYDAY OCCURENCE!
  And now…I sit and read this debate and comments on the schools in Pekin and their “need” Don’t make me laugh, people. Pekin High School is a state of the art facility, with programs and extra-curriculars that no ohter schools in downstate Illinois have. You Pekinnites have no idea how good you have it there. And yet you will all continue to whine and complain on how needy you are and how concerned with saving money you are. I personally was a graduate if District 150. NOW YOU TELL ME HOW BAD YOU HAVE IT in your self-contained little world of Pekin. My high school didn’t even have a large enough auditorium to have a full school assembly…we had to divide them up, my school didnt have a TV station, a debate program, or money to be able to take our students to nationals in forensics. You are spoiled…plain and simple. Quit your bitching…you have a great school system both at 303 and 108. Quit complaining about what you do not have and more about what you do…simply put, it could be worse, your kids could be in district 150!!!!

• 16    Michelle // Dec 30, 2006 at 5:49 am

  I’ve seen this many times before and it really puzzles me — people claiming that all of those who disagree with them are “the elite.” Why is this? The previous poster uses the word twice! What is “the elite” anyway? The dictionary defines it as the “most choice” or “select.” So is it people who are smarter? Better educated? In a higher socio-economic group? Are any of these things bad things? And how do you decide whether someone is “elite” or not? By whether they agree or disagree with you? Wouldn’t one automatically consider one’s own group to be the “elite” group rather than hand that distinction to those with whom you disagree? Seriously, I’d like to know how the word “elite” came to be used disparagingly.

  I’m really interested in seeing some information that would prove or at least suggest consolidation would improve education. Nobody has been able to quote a study or even explain how they think it would help. All I’ve seen so far is incorrect information stating that test scores are below average — which they are not — but no indication at all of how consolidation would increase them.

  Mr. Mangan has referred to those who don’t agree with him as weak-minded, delusional, drunks, etc. I prefer to debate the question of consolidation without questioning the minds or morals of those who disagree with me.

  Disagreement is just fine, but I’m sincerely puzzled by how you can say he has “cut through the crap” and told the truth. All he has done is present false information about test scores and call others names and question various peoples’ integrity. Some people might enjoy hearing him rant about school officials, but that isn’t “cutting through the crap.” On the contrary.

  You don’t have to take “the elite’s” opinion, and shouldn’t. You should look at the test scores yourself, and you should look through all Mr. Mangan’s writings for an explanation of how consolidation might raise test scores. I’m afraid you will not find one.

  I try to be an open-minded person. I’ve researched this question pretty thoroughly via information from the state board of education and from state report cards and by comparing test scores and tax rates of neighboring districts. I believe I have read everything Mr. Mangan has published. I have zero personal gain to be made either way, and my children are both out of District 108 now. I don’t work for either district and am not close to anyone who does. Other than the minor real estate taxes I pay and my desire for good public education, I don’t have any stake in this question at all. I don’t have any personal agenda here, so no reason to be biased for or against consolidation. I’m not against consolidation in principle. In some situations consolidation makes good sense. (For example, Limestone High School has a ridiculous number of feeder districts, all of which go to one high school. In their situation, I believe consolidation would probably be the best thing. But we don’t have that same situation here).

  The simple truth is, I have found absolutely no advantage — and several potential disadvantages — to consolidation in Pekin. Agree with me or don’t agree with me, but please accept that I formed my opinion by researching the facts. I could respect the opinions of those on the other side if they would accept the challenge to present whatever facts they can find that support their view that consolidation would improve local education.

• 17    knightindragonland // Dec 30, 2006 at 6:03 am

  You make a few good points, Jaded … but I could do without the Pekin slamming. You could have made your point without stooping to that. No matter how many people you encountered here as a waitress, you didn’t meet everyone. Your sweeping and insulting generalizations aren’t helpful.

  I went through District 150 about the same time you did … if you’re 35, as your MySpace site says. I’m 34. My experience there was excellent, and there continue to be some great schools in District 150. But I get your point, and it’s a point that I’ve made myself. District 150 is a unified primary / secondary district, and their state test scores are worse than Pekin’s. How does consolidation help them?

  In every school, there are people who thrive and do well, even if the situation isn’t ideal. In every school (except elite private schools that simply kick to the curb those that can’t cut it) there are those who don’t do so well, who are on the verge of dropping out. Is it wrong to want to improve their lot? Does the TV station at Pekin High help them? Does the debate team help them?

  Even if things look good here from an outside perspective, isn’t it a good thing to want better for your children? I’m sorry … I’m not going to sit back and be satisfied. When it comes to education, I think we should always be pushing, pushing, pushing for better and better and better. You’re a single mom … wouldn’t you agree???

• 18    knightindragonland // Dec 30, 2006 at 6:15 am

  I’m going to go play some video games now … Michelle can take over for me!

• 19    jadedgirl // Dec 30, 2006 at 7:11 am

  Yes…Knight, you make some good points too. I agree with most of what you say in your posts, I like your blog and read a lot.

  I would agree that pushing for better education is a good thing, and being a single mother, I also love the comfort of the fact that my son goes to a great school, with great teachers. I want what is best for my child. I think we all do.

  My point about the extra curriculars at Pekin is this: Pekin should focus on making the school better as a whole, and worrying more about the things that matter rather than spend money on extra curriculars and things of the sort. If the test scores are low…why not focus on extra tutoring, or a help lab rather than flow that money into things like a TV station or a contest play? I see a lot of talk about standardized test scores in general…ok this is my gripe about the whole “No Child Left Behind” Buisness…
  I am sure you already know this, but this is what I found out about that particular act…The scores are based on the WHOLE of the student body…which includes the mentally and physically challenged, the behaviorial special education, the developmental special education, the advanced placement students, and the rest of the mainstream…as a whole. They all take the very same test…the exact same to the letter test…So, what we have is Students in special education taking the same algebra, english lit, physics…etc…questions as the advanced placement student. The scores are low because the tests are biased. How can the government expect a 10th grader who reads and writes at a 4th grade level to be able to score higher or as high as a student who has been studying advanced math/physics since 9th grade? It’s a crushing blow to the already lacking self esteem of a “slower” student…who struggles to get c’s in Basic math and reading?

  My co-worker used to work for a smaller local newspaper, and she interviewed The prinicpal at Pekin High School in regard to the “No Child” act, and his answer was: that you cannot expect me to test those lower functioning students at that level…So the test scores are low because I DON’T. The special ed students dont take the test at all, and we register zero’s for them. I refuse to make them feel any less than they already do. I will not wound their self esteem further.
  Good job, teach. Here’s to putting your students first. (Doesnt happen often)
  So basically…Pekin worries about money for funding, and due to low test scores because of the prinicpals stand they miss out on it. Who’s to blame???
  The people should Vote For the right president this time…and things might get better, and Pekin schools wont have to consolidate.

  Basically…it has to filter downhill. It has to start at the higher echelons of government… the “Big Dogs” (if you will) and roll down hill all the way to Pekin Illinois. If we do nothing to affect change at the national level, we can’t expect our local represenatives, senators, congressmen, governor to be able to do much, either.

  So when election day finally comes….(and it cannot come soon enough as far as I am concerned) vote for the ones who have promised to start small and work upward. No Child Left Behind needs to be rethought, revised, and rewritten…for the sake of Pekin and Peoria…so that the river that devides us doesnt seem so wide in the future.

  I apologize about the Pekin slamming too by the way…I tend to get carried away at times. You are right, I haven’t met everyone there, and I probably shouldn’t generalize. I just want to say in my defense though…that the large number of people I DID encounter were an odd lot, and I always felt like I was treated like “the help” while I lived and worked there. I have some friends that are native sons and daughters of the town, and I love them dearly…but most of the people I have met were not good…not good at all.

  I certainly didn’t mean to offend, but If you had been made to feel the way I was, you would probably have a chip about Pekin too.

  Much luck with the efforts, sincerely-
  Jaded

  P.S. Just for the record…I don’t live in Peoria now, I did grow up there though…and I wouldn’t move back if you paid me. Mostly because of District 150.

• 20    knightindragonland // Dec 30, 2006 at 7:49 am

  Thank you for bringing up the limitations of the No Child Left Behind Act (NCLBA), Jaded. Not many people realize that kids with special education needs are forced to test at the same level as their same-age peers, despite the fact that they might be operating at a level far lower than that.

  Since the NCLBA was the “brain child” of George W. Bush and his buddies who want to eliminate the Department of Education, I really think its intention was to “prove” that all public schools are failures and that education should be privatized. It’s inflexibility is ridiculous, and it mandates solutions from on high, stifling creative solutions at the local level.

  Tom Frazier, commenting on this blog, has indicated that these stifling restrictions and mandates are the REAL reason Mark Sattazahn resigned from District 108 … not disgust over social promotion as Mike Noyes contends.

  The NCLBA also mandates that by 2014, all schools should have a 100% pass rate. Now, on what test, no matter how simple, are you going to get 100% passing when you’re testing thousands of kids (including those with special education needs)??? It’s absolutely ridiculous! As a a colleague of mine once said, it’s the EVERY Child Left WAY Behind Act.

• 21    jadedgirl // Dec 30, 2006 at 5:01 pm

  I totally agree.

• 22    Ms. Teacher // Dec 30, 2006 at 11:19 pm

  Wow, if I had known this was getting so heated, I would have joined the “discussion” a long time ago.

  As it is, I think the best thing for me to say is this: we’re working so hard for your kids. I promise you that we are. Unless you are in the schools, you have literally no idea the number of hats we all wear. Yes, there is room for improvement – there always is – and we are meeting every challenge head on because we believe in these kids. Sure, we have an overall percentage of nearly 50% low income students in the district, and sure, we have over 400 special education students being forced to take state tests above their levels, BUT WE ARE KICKING ASS. I beg you – look at the school report card. Our ISAT scores are above the state average and getting higher every year.

  Everyone goes to school, which makes some people believe they are experts on everything that happens in a school district. This could not be further from the truth. That may sound like an insult, but it is impossible to know the incredible work that’s being done here unless you are in the thick of it everyday.

  Think of teaching as a play. The students are the audience, and we always hope that they will leave our classrooms with knowledge and satisfaction that they may not have entered it with. The teachers are the actors, writers, directors, lighting specialists, makeup artists, stagehands, promoters, ticket takers…every job – no matter how crucial or how (seemingly) minimal – is done by the teachers. It is truly an all-emcompassing job, and I am proud and grateful to do it.

  That being said, however, I am continually shocked by the hateful and untrue statements that I hear about our teachers, our administrators, and our district. It is sad to me that a district that is NATIONALLY recognized for its excellence cannot be recognized by its own town. Wake up, Pekin. We’re doing good things here.

  Does District 108 want the consolidation? I can’t speak for everyone, but I do not. I have listened to the research Dr. White has done, and I have investigated it myself, and the most important questions – frankly, the only one I even care about – has not been answered: How is consolidation going to help improve the education we’re providing our students? How will it make learning easier? How will it improve test scores? Anyone?

  I don’t know. You don’t know. Jim Mangan doesn’t know. I think it’s high time we all took a closer look about why this issue is even an issue to begin with.

• 23    Tom // Dec 31, 2006 at 2:09 am

  To Ms. teacher, thanks again for speaking up for the wonderful teachers and staff at 108. I am very happy with the education my 2 children are receiving in this district. Your job does not go unnoticed.

• 24    jadedgirl // Dec 31, 2006 at 6:57 pm

  I applaud you as well Ms. Teacher. All teachers struggle, and go very unnoticed throughout their careers. They don’t call it a “noble” profession for nothing. I was never a teacher myself, but I did work as a speech coach for district 150 for 11 years. I have seen with my own eyes and heard with my own ears what the teaching staff goes through on a daily basis, and I understand your frustration. Keep plugging away, and know that there are some people out there who do believe in making poistive change that effects every student….not just some.
  Happy new year to all, and good luck Pekinites with your struggle…
  Sincerely-
  Jadedgirl

• 25    knightindragonland // Dec 31, 2006 at 11:49 pm

  Michelle, Tom, Jaded, Ms Teacher …
  Thanks for the reinforcement.

• 26    Marcy // Jan 2, 2007 at 12:43 am

  My….all this feel good patting each other on the back stuff is proof this site is only for the one sided. And serious examination is treated like a skunk. Do you ever get tired of masterbating your ego’s?

• 27    jadedgirl // Jan 2, 2007 at 1:22 am

  Marcy-
  Do you ever get tired of being a pain in the ass?
  Just wondering.
  I must have met you when I was bartending over in Pekin…Extra lemons for your water, perhaps????

  If you don’t like the site…don’t dwell here…drama doesn’t help to solve any problems. Your “comments” were taken into consideration like all of the rest, by Knight…he just didn’t agree with them. You made your point…now carry on.

  Sincerely-
  Jadedgirl

  P.S. Masturbating is spelled wrong, you might wanna take advantage of your spell check. Here…I’ll help you out..

  Main Entry: mas·tur·bate
  Pronunciation: ‘mas-t&r-”bAt
  Function: verb
  Inflected Form(s): -bat·ed; -bat·ing
  Etymology: Latin masturbatus, past participle of masturbari
  intransitive verb : to practice masturbation
  transitive verb : to practice masturbation on
  - mas·tur·ba·tor /-”bA-t&r/ noun

  Maybe if you did more of this yourself, you wouldn’t be so uptight.

• 28    knightindragonland // Jan 2, 2007 at 1:45 am

  Ohhh Marcy … such wit and poignant argument.

  What “serious examination” have we “treated like a skunk”? I have yet to hear ANYTHING serious from you or Matt … and Paul only made a half-hearted effort to enter a real debate and then resorted to name calling.

  You apparently just want to insult people who disagree with you. You have nothing intelligent to add to the conversation. So … make an argument. I’d welcome a REAL debate instead of this sophomoric name calling. If your only plan is to add further insults, you’re going to be deleted. Grow up.

• 29    Tom // Jan 3, 2007 at 1:02 am

  Marcy, I didn’t know that telling a teacher that I appreciate the work she does is considered feel good patting. I call them as i see them and have had no reason to dislike or question any of the teachers my children have had, or any that I have had the pleasure of dealing with. Maybe you have. I also feel like it’s about time a teacher speaks out against the bad rap they are getting. if you have a problem with that then that’s a shame. i can’t help you.
  As far as back patting goes, you have done your fair share of that with Mr. Mangan. You seem to run to his aid on this site. What’s the difference? The fact is that we do not believe that consolidation will in any way help education or lower taxes enough to amount to anything, if at all.
  Secondly, as the law is written, consolidation will not happen anyway, so why all this bickering about it.

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